Why we are here

I initially wrote this as a comment for reddit, but it’s worth a post since many men don’t understand the various interactions with lots of the different men’s blogs.

  1. Over the past 100+ years (or perhaps 1000+ years as Aaron Renn’s Masculinist newsletter investigates), much of western Christianity has incorporated a lot of secular beliefs into their sex/gender perspectives. Christianity has been increasingly feminized while male masculinity has become more demonized. Fake perspectives like Christian egalitarianism and complementarism have arisen.
  2. Many in the Church espouse typical cultural phrases like “happy wife, happy life” or “gotta listen to the boss” which is direct contradiction to the Bible (e.g. Ephesians 5). Likewise, as divorce and brokenness in homes has increased by liberal policies, men and women are not fathered and mentored as much as they used to which has resulted in much dysfunction. Not that conservatives are any better because they’re not. Like Christ, Christians should not be concerned about changing politics but about changing hearts with the gospel.
  3. Most dating advice follows an untruthful bent, especially in Christian communities. “Just be yourself” is one of the common ones that doesn’t help, and in the Christian community “focus on being godly” or “just pray and God will have it all in His time” are some of the common ones. This is unhelpful to Christian men who are unsuccessful with women.
  4. During the late 90s, 00s, and early ’10s, the pick up artist (PUA) community was all about discovering what worked to get laid. This slowly morphed into discussion boards on the internet. During the late 00s and early ’10s, this group started to pick up steam on the Internet and started fracturing into various groups: PUAs, secular red pill, red pill women, men’s rights, incels, etc. Probably the most prolific Christian blog (Dalrock) on exposing the false beliefs of the culture and how they have been incorporated into the Church started around 2010 or 2011.
  5. Many Christians who were bad with women ultimately saw that some of these concepts worked, which had been contrary to the typical advice they had been preached to when they were teens or young adults in the Church. Many of these Christians get sucked into the secular RP and lose their faith.
  6. Since God created man and woman, the Truth in the Scriptures about male and female relationships is clearly true. Much of this lines up with what the secular RP has come to conclude through trial and error (man should be the head of the family, have a mission bigger than himself, wife is helper and shouldn’t be put on a pedestal, etc.). Some high profile secular RP leaders like Roosh and Victor ultimately see that hedonism and sex is all worthless in the end without God.
  7. As far as the reddit RPChristians goes, the founder started it with the intent to understand and apply what the Bible actually teaches about marriage and relationships and to minister/outreach to the secular RP (much like organizations like XXX Christians which minister to porn stars). Since there are not a lot of spaces where Christian men and women can discuss sexuality without fear of reprisal, this is one of those spaces.
  8. We don’t incorporate RP philosophy into what we do because the Bible is the ultimate Truth, but we may use RP terms to communicate concepts that the Bible teaches.

Some Q&A on why we may use RP terms. Personally, I try not to use RP terms anymore since they’ve become loaded words. They don’t effectively communicate what you’re trying to say much like hash tags or liberal/conservative catch phrases.

How would you categorize your philosophies/theology to someone unfamiliar with RP?

We teach what the Bible says, but we may use RP concepts to explain it as many men from secular RP understand the terms in that way.

Many men even here may think it’s about incorporating RP beliefs into Christianity, but that’s false. You can’t incorporate other beliefs into Christianity and have it still be Christianity. It’s just your own pet version of Christianity.

Would you simply say you’re an RP Christian? Or is there another overarching name for this type of theology. Personally, I had never heard of RP and it’s hard to find online resources or commentaries on your interpretations of scripture.

No, I’m just a Christian who believes what the Bible says about men and women and doesn’t get caught up in what the culture teaches which is mostly false. Men and women are not the same. They have different traits they look for in the spouses. Each have a sin nature that they need to resist.

Most Christians who are not familiar with the sub think that we are trying to incorporate RP philosophy on top of the Bible but that is furthest from the case. Because we use the term RP in the name and thus are “associated” with the secular RP, we’re often biased against for stating the truth in other subs for just posting here.

Is this isolated to reddit? Do you meet up with groups or attend churches with those who adhere to these same beliefs?

There’s associated Christian blogs.

As far as I know, there are no groups or Churches specifically, but individual men may go back to their churches and start teaching actual Biblical truth in their small groups and ministries and even pastors. In some churches, some men have gotten kicked out or asked to stop.

And one good answer from the reddit founder about why it’s not putting on an RP lens but taking off the cultural feminized lens.

That’s because very few believers have delved into the Bible’s views on sexuality enough to produce content exclusively focused on it that aren’t tainted by serious cultural baggage. This, of course, makes a lot of sense when you consider how it was culturally inappropriate to speak openly about explicit sexual matters for all but the last 75-ish years of the world’s history. It is the feminization of the world that brought on the sexual revolution, so it’s not surprising that the content that’s been generated on the topic is feminized as well.

To go from a different angle, if I were to write a “red pill commentary” on the Bible, it would look extremely close to a blend of many other commentaries already in existence. I’m not going to read the book of Nahum or Daniel and try to force some “RP lens” into how the book should be interpreted. But there are some passages where a proper interpretation has been lost on those who have been conditioned by culture to have a butterflies-and-rainbows view of who Jesus was and feminized notions of marriage and sexuality. That is:

  • We don’t put on an “RP Lens” to Scriptural interpretation. We take off the “Feminized Lens” that everyone else is wearing, then interpret Scripture without that bias. This leads to many similar conclusions, but a few extremely significant different ones too.

To be abundantly clear: there are MANY commentaries that will preach the same things we do. But again, one of our principles is relevant here: Watch what people do, not what they say. This is a twist on the “Do as I say, not as I do” motto that’s become a popular joke about churches – because many pastors will not live out what they preach. In this sense, you may READ many commentaries that preach proper principles of marriage, sexuality, headship, etc. – but good luck finding a body that actually practices them. Congregations will pay lip service to Scripture, but conform their behaviors to culture.

The author deleted his post eventually, but our comments are still up. Also, some of the mods and regulars have started some roundtable video series on YouTube. Subscribe if you can, as YouTube only allows livestreams if you have 1k subscriptions or more, and I think a lot of Christian men and women would like being able to interact in real time.

Overall, I think it should be abundantly clear that the reason why we are all here is that the Church is conforming too much to the culture. That’s why the majority of the New Testament was written to tell the Church to stop doing that. We are in this same boat.

My goal as a Christian is to lead by example to show single and married Christian men that doing what God says (in the Bible on the topic of marriage) is the right thing to do, and that it will produce good fruit. Real effective change is made through godly discipleship.

For instance, if you have any shame or discomfort talking publicly to Christians or non-Christians about the gospel then that may be an area to work on. But sadly, maybe a harder thing to do is to tell those same people that you’re the head of your marriage and that your wife submits to you and why that is good.

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14 Responses to Why we are here

  1. Reblogged this on Spartan Christianity and commented:
    Spectacular. I find myself leaning too much in Red Pill in my own writing as well. This is a good distinction: Don’t put on a red pill lens, just take off the feminized lens.

    Great work Deep Strength!

  2. Jack says:

    I think God has used the Red Pill movement as a catalyst to get Christianity back to the basics and back on track.

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  4. donalgraeme says:

    Jack, I agree. He has a track record of using non-believers to help get the faithful back on track. Just look at ancient Israel. Pretty clear examples there.

  5. feeriker says:

    This is unhelpful to Christian men who are unsuccessful with women.

    A good example of the church’s convergence with the culture. In the broader secular culture there is no sincere desire to help men who have trouble relating to women, and thus are unable to form a meaningful and permanent bond with one as a helpmeet for life. Inside, secular culture goes out of its way to disparage, mock, and marginalize such men. The church has been doing the same thing in modern times, although perhaps more subtly than the culture. The end result is still the same.

  6. JPF says:

    The influence of foreigners on disobedient Israel was not pleasant either. War and exile are not pretty. If you believe in the “rainbows and unicorns” version of God, you may want to consider why God would threaten his people with war from foreigners if they disobeyed… and then carried out the threat multiple times.

  7. JPF says:

    dating advice… in the Christian community “focus on being godly”

    Yes, the advice to only focus on being godly is one of the most stupid things a marriage-seeking Christian man could accept.
    Certainly, have loving God as your first priority. (Matthew 22:36-40)
    But if you want a wife, be the man that will be a strong leader in the home. (Song of Songs, Colossians 3:18-21, Eph 5, etc.)

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  11. JPF says:

    My goal as a Christian is to lead by example to show single and married Christian men that doing what God says (in the Bible on the topic of marriage) is the right thing to do, and that it will produce good fruit. Real effective change is made through godly discipleship.

    Excellent; well said. Titus 2:7a – In everything set them an example by doing what is good.

  12. ‘The world has yet to see what God can do with and for and through and in a man who is fully and wholly consecrated to Him.’

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